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Being Browbeaten by John3:16's KJV


06-26-2015, 02:39 PM #1
Serveto
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This thread is spun-off from ===>this one (click here)

John 3:16 Wrote:Christ is not a prophet ...

I, Serveto Wrote:You might want to notify Cleopas and his companion. This, according to Luke, is what they reported:
"... And they [Cleopas et al] said unto him [Jesus], Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, which was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people."

J316 Wrote:Scripture verse please?

I provided it.  Point your mouse on the scripture and click (the URL is embedded as a link).

J316 Wrote:Thingy bob Muslim here ...

You are being rude.  I thought that you, as a Christian, are supposed to be an ambassador for Christ (it is written somewhere).  If so, from a diplomatic standpoint, rude behavior is seriously ill advised.
   
J316 Wrote:Go figure, I'm Christisn he's a Muslim. Eye roll.

You are still being rude.

J316 Wrote:The prophets ended at Malachi. The Old Testament.

Really?  Is that what you would have told this crowd (click here)?  They seem to have thought otherwise, that Jesus was a prophet.  It's quite interesting to hear a Christian correct them on that score.

J316 Wrote:I found the scripture ...

You didn't have to search far.  Again, I had provided the link

J316 Wrote:...Cleophas said Jesus was a prophet when he was actually speaking to the resurrected Christ at the time, he was supernaturally prevented from recognising him at this point. In verse 24:24 Jesus called them fools for not realzing who he really was. Aka GOd ...

I don't trust your exegesis and neither do I accept your adding words to the scripture.  The fact remains that Cleopas identified Jesus as a prophet of God and Jesus did not correct him for that.  And why should he?  Elsewhere, Jesus identifies himself (click here) as a prophet.  Are you going to now suggest that Jesus should correct himself?

J316 Wrote:As I call you a fool now too ...

Granted, I am not your brother, but, with such a loose tongue, aren't you speaking recklessly ===>click here?

J316 Wrote:See folks this is scripture swithering at its finest, subtle deceptive bible disinformation terrorism. Taking a word out of context, lying in other words, punishable by eternal torment in HELL.

Are you playing to the gallery?  Thus far, allow me to point out that you are the one who has contradicted first Cleopas and now Jesus by saying that Jesus was not a prophet.  You can stop the histrionics and scaremongering: neither is at all effective with me.


Serv
This post was last modified: 06-26-2015, 03:42 PM by Serveto.
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06-26-2015, 04:11 PM #2
John3:16
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I'll play to gallery if you start a thread about me. Christ called Cephas a fool, Mark 24:24, no adding to scripture. That's enough for me, no experts required as I'm an expert.  Big Grin

Just because fools and Muslims think and say he was a prophet doesn't mean he was one, Christianity 101 part A Jesus Christ is God. Hello, Is any body home? Rhetorical question. It's what that big book with the little writing and all the numbers in it called the bible is ALL about, the Revelation of Jesus Christ. Try reading it instead of googling atheist propaganda about it. Now go back to sleep.
This post was last modified: 06-26-2015, 04:19 PM by John3:16.

06-26-2015, 04:51 PM #3
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Quote:Nontrinitarianism (or antitrinitarianism) refers to Christian belief systems that reject the doctrine of the Trinity as not having scriptural origin. Nontrinitarian views differ widely on the nature of God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. Various nontrinitarian views, such as Adoptionism, Monarchianism and Arianism existed prior to the formal definition of the Trinity doctrine in 325, 360, and 431 AD, at the Councils of Nicaea, Constantinople, and Ephesus.[104] Following the final victory of orthodoxy at Constantinople in 381, Arianism was driven from the Empire, retaining a foothold amongst the Teutonic tribes. When the Franks converted to Catholicism in 496, however, it gradually faded out.[105] Nontrinitarianism was later renewed in the Gnosticism of the Cathars in the 11th through 13th centuries, in the Age of Enlightenment of the 18th century, and in some groups arising during the Second Great Awakening of the 19th century.

Modern nontrinitarian groups or denominations include Christadelphians, Christian Scientists, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Dawn Bible Students, Friends General Conference, Iglesia ni Cristo, Jehovah's Witnesses, Living Church of God, Members Church of God International, Oneness Pentecostals, the Seventh Day Church of God, Unitarian Universalist Christians and the United Church of God.

Islam and Judaism traditionally profess a concept of monotheism with a singular person as God,[106] and consequently reject trinitarianism. Islam considers Jesus to be a prophet but not divine,[107] and Allah to be absolutely indivisible;[108] several verses of the Quran state that the Trinity doctrine is blasphemous.[109]

   "Say: He is God, the One and Only; God, the Eternal, Absolute; He begetteth not, nor is He begotten; And there is none like unto Him.
   —Qur'an, sura 112 (Al-Ikhlas), ayat 1-4[110]

Quote:The current mainstream teaching in Christianity is that God is a coequal, coeternal, one-substance trinity, and that Jesus Christ is God. This doctrine is considered by many as the cornerstone of Christianity, but where did this doctrine come from? The historical record is overwhelming that the church of the first three centuries did not worship God as a coequal, coeternal, consubstantial, one-substance three in one mysterious godhead. The early church worshipped one God and believed in a subordinate Son. The trinity originated with Babylon, and was passed on to most of the world's religions. This polytheistic (believing in more than one god) trinitarianism was intertwined with Greek religion and philosophy and slowly worked its way into Christian thought and creeds some 300 years after Christ. The idea of "God the Son" is Babylonian paganism and mythology that was grafted into Christianity. Worshipping "God the Son" is idolatry, and idolatry is Biblically condemned; it breaks the first great commandment of God of not having any gods before him (Exodus 20:3). Then three centuries after Christ the corrupt emperor Constantine forced the minority opinion of the trinity upon the council of Nicea. The Christian church went downward from there; in fact some of the creeds and councils actually contradict each other. The council of Nicea 325 said that "Jesus Christ is God," the council of Constantinople 381 said that "the Holy Spirit is God," the council of Ephesus 431 said that "human beings are totally depraved," the council of Chalcedon 451 said that "Jesus Christ is both man and God." If you follow the logic here then first you have Jesus Christ as God, then you have man totally depraved, and then you have Jesus Christ as man and God. If Jesus Christ is both man and God does this mean that God is also totally depraved? Well maybe the doctrine of the coequal, coeternal, one-substance, mysterious three in one triune godhead is deprived of any historical foundation tying it into the Christianity of the Bible and the Christianity of the first three centuries. However the historical information ties the trinity into various pagan origins.
This post was last modified: 06-26-2015, 04:54 PM by justjess.

06-26-2015, 05:33 PM #4
Serveto
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(06-26-2015, 04:11 PM)John3:16 Wrote:  I'll play to gallery if you start a thread about me.

You were playing to the gallery well before I started the thread.  But now, here in the spotlight, you have the opportunity to grandstand.  You have me to thank for that.

Quote:Christ called Cephas a fool, Mark 24:24, no adding to scripture. That's enough for me, no experts required as I'm an expert.  Big Grin

Sometimes, you are both quick-witted and funny.  I wish you could put those traits to better use on this board.  I hadn't read many of your posts before I jumped in and started talking, but, if I had, I might have seen that you are apparently under a lot of pressure both here and off the board.  I am sorry about that.   Despite its title, which I chose because you called me a fool, which are fighting words, I have no particular need to continue with this thread if it is going to be merely contentious or degenerate into "vain jangling."    

Quote:Just because fools and Muslims think and say he was a prophet doesn't mean he was one ...

Given that Jesus reportedly called himself a prophet, which of the two does that make him: a fool or a Muslim? Hello.  Is anybody home?  If so, click here, real hard.  

Quote:...It's what that big book with the little writing and all the numbers in it called the bible is ALL about, the Revelation of Jesus Christ. Try reading it instead of googling atheist propaganda about it.

I am sitting in Sunday School class next to you and I therefore have my football pads on, advisedly.  You don't seem overly observant, so allow me to point out that, far from atheist propaganda, the only links I have thus far provided in what passes for a discussion are quotes from "that big book with little writing and all the numbers in it."  Wake up, read it, and stop contradicting it.


Serv
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06-26-2015, 07:47 PM #5
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John 3:16 got "Served" Big Grin

Scimi

Out beyond ideas
of wrong-doing,


and right-doing,

there is a field...

...I'll meet you there.
€



Jalaluddin Rumi

06-26-2015, 08:27 PM #6
John3:16
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ONah, Jesus didn't Say the words "I am prophet" he simply stated a fact about prophets. You really just can't let God be God can you. We are fools, I've been a fool most of my life, I'm trying to change that.

(06-26-2015, 07:47 PM)Scimitar Wrote:  John 3:16 got "Served" Big Grin

Scimi

Small things amuse small minds.
This post was last modified: 06-26-2015, 08:31 PM by John3:16.

06-26-2015, 08:42 PM #7
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Do you actually have an argument? your premise seems highly personal and emotional Big Grin much like every Trinitarian bible bashing Christian I have come across - you don't know your bible history and are in denial of the canonisation process due to the embarrassment it leaves you in - if you have the conviction of your belief - then debate me instead of playing ad hoc games with me Big Grin

I only left you a calling card to draw you out of your comfort zone Smile

My challenge, debate me on the authenticity of your Scripture Smile

Come on lad.

İmage

Scimi

Out beyond ideas
of wrong-doing,


and right-doing,

there is a field...

...I'll meet you there.
€



Jalaluddin Rumi

06-26-2015, 11:14 PM #8
Serveto
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Hey, Scimi, it's like John and I are at Wimbledon.
__________________________________________

John3:16 Wrote:Christ is not a prophet ...
John3:16 Wrote:ONah, Jesus didn't Say the words "I am prophet" he simply stated a fact about prophets.

Ok, the crowd is wrong to call Jesus a prophet; Cleopas et. al., though never corrected by Jesus himself,are altogether incorrect to refer to Jesus as a prophet; Jesus, when referring to a prophet being without honor in his own country, was not referring to himself, despite the fact that he was the one then suffering dishonor at the hands of his countrymen.  Let's try this: If Jesus is not a prophet, why did St. Peter quote this verse (from Deuteronomy18:15) as presumably referring to him?

"For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you ...[bold emphasis mine]" (Acts 3:22)

Quote:You really just can't let God be God can you.

This is a complete and utter non-sequitur.  The problem is neither me nor mine.  You claim, despite Biblical statements to the contrary, that Jesus is not a prophet.  It seems to me that all you would really need to do, at this point, is back up a bit and say something like this (unless you don't believe it): "I think that Jesus, though also a prophet, is more than a prophet ("a greater than Moses is here"): I think he is the incarnation of God himself."  If you had said that, on what basis could I have challenged your statement?  

Quote:We are fools ...

That's a switch.  It's nice to see you include yourself among the company of us fools.

Quote:... I've been  a fool most of my life, I'm trying to change that.

Confession, as they say, is good for the soul.  Do your best.  One can expect no more than that.      


Serv
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06-26-2015, 11:34 PM #9
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(06-26-2015, 04:11 PM)John3:16 Wrote:  no experts required as I'm an expert.  Big Grin

Nope, you are an "impert" - inent idiot. Is what you are. Good bye fella, deja vu? Big Grin

Serveto Wrote:Hey, Scimi, it's like John and I are at Wimbledon.

He's actually the infamous troll known to us longterm VCers as "DDT" ... he got banned and started his own cult, which never really worked out for him - so he came back under another ID, thinking we wouldn't know Big Grin Oh we know alright, there can only be one uber fool of his caliber on the webs. He doesn't fool anyone Big Grin thus, he got banned sharpish...

....as for your tennis match - I guess he got disqualified for cheating Big Grin you win bud.

Somewhere in the distance - I hear "you can't be serious" Big Grin yeah... we iz sirius Big Grin we is vigilantz, we do the boogie woo and leave you in the poo DDT.

Scimi
This post was last modified: 06-26-2015, 11:37 PM by Scimitar.

Out beyond ideas
of wrong-doing,


and right-doing,

there is a field...

...I'll meet you there.
€



Jalaluddin Rumi

06-27-2015, 10:28 AM #10
Serveto
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(06-26-2015, 11:34 PM)Scimitar Wrote:  
(06-26-2015, 04:11 PM)John3:16 Wrote:  no experts required as I'm an expert.  Big Grin

Nope, you are an "impert" - inent idiot. Is what you are. Good bye fella, deja vu? Big Grin

Serveto Wrote:Hey, Scimi, it's like John and I are at Wimbledon.

He's actually the infamous troll known to us longterm VCers as "DDT" ... he got banned and started his own cult, which never really worked out for him - so he came back under another ID, thinking we wouldn't know Big Grin Oh we know alright, there can only be one uber fool of his caliber on the webs. He doesn't fool anyone Big Grin thus, he got banned sharpish...

....as for your tennis match - I guess he got disqualified for cheating Big Grin you win bud.

Somewhere in the distance - I hear "you can't be serious" Big Grin yeah... we iz sirius Big Grin we is vigilantz, we do the boogie woo and leave you in the poo DDT.

Scimi

It sounds to me as though y'all had way too much fun on some of those older boards.  I regret not having been here to add to the pillow fight.

Serv
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