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Who are the Real Muslims?

04-25-2016, 04:18 AM #1
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Throughout my time on this forum, I’ve interacted with many self-proclaiming Muslims in numerous topics. Whether it’s on topics from Jesus Christ being the Son of God to the question of the God of the Bible and Quran, are the same. Be as the title of this thread states, we are not here to discuss those topics. Instead our main focus is to once and for all, at least in my own perspective, into figuring out who the Real Muslims are.  I don’t expect everyone here to take my view on Islam as absolute truth. That should be obvious; but I do want you to consider the facts. I’m predicting though, as we see the answers from Muslims on this forum, will help to prove a few points that I will make. I’ve said in a previous thread that I don’t base all my facts from a single source, no. If the information I have gathered happens to be consistent, then there is no way around it as being true. Please be aware, that I am not trying to start uproar in the Islamic community on this forum. I made this thread because I want answers to my questions in regards to both the Quran and the Muslims who represent the Quran. Let’s try to stay on topic please.

A few things I want to address before we get into the Quran and differentiating self-proclaiming Muslims and Real Muslims. Is Islam a religion of peace and if so, then why is the term “Islam is a religion of peace” even phrased in the first place? We don’t see much protest or desperate attempts to defend a faith like Christianity or Judaism being a religion of peace. But why does Islam have such a need for this phrase? Who first coined this phrase? Well, I don’t exactly know, but as I was looking through some of the earliest years when this phrase was first said, it was always said after an attack from self-proclaiming Muslims.
Quote:The Arabic term Islam (إسلام) is derived from aslama, which means "to surrender" or "resign oneself".[4][5] The Arabic word salaam (سلام) ("peace") shares the same consonantal root (s-l-m) with the words Islam and Muslim.
Muslims who are keen to emphasise their rejection of violence have used the phrase "a religion of peace" as a description of Islam, like Dalil Boubakeur, mufti of the Paris Mosque, who said in 2006,

"The prophet did not found a terrorist religion, but a religion of peace."[7] After the 7/7 London bombings, some Muslims in the West increased their efforts to present Islam as a peaceful religion.[8]

Quote:Two of the bombers made videotapes describing their reasons for becoming what they called "soldiers". In a videotape broadcast by Al Jazeera on 1 September 2005, Muhammad Sidique Khan, described his motivation. The tape had been edited and also featured al-Qaeda member—and future leader—Ayman al-Zawahiri:[11]

“              I and thousands like me are forsaking everything for what we believe. Our drive and motivation doesn't come from tangible commodities that this world has to offer. Our religion is Islam, obedience to the one true God and following the footsteps of the final prophet messenger. Your democratically-elected governments continuously perpetuate atrocities against my people all over the world. And your support of them makes you directly responsible, just as I am directly responsible for protecting and avenging my Muslim brothers and sisters. Until we feel security you will be our targets and until you stop the bombing, gassing, imprisonment and torture of my people we will not stop this fight. We are at war and I am a soldier. Now you too will taste the reality of this situation.                 ”


After the attack of 9/11 and other attacks like the 7/7 London bombings, the Muslim community believed it was their duty to defend Islam and to promote Islam as a religion of peace.  I already know and believe many on this forum can agree that the U.S. planned the destruction of the 2 towers along with the pentagon and Building 7 to justify the U.S. going into Iraq. But we also can’t ignore Muslims who kill in the name of Islam and Allah. So this leads into my next question.

Why do some Muslims justify terrorist acts? Whether it’s “staged” or a “false flag”? One of the most common arguments and debates when a Muslim commits a terrorist act or I’d rather state it as, simply a crime of any caliber enters into Israel and attempts to kill, rob, harass a Jew or a born and raised resident of Israel and is justified by the Muslim community? It’s justified by some Muslims, even by some Muslims on this forum, saying something along the lines of “The Jews for many years, oppressed and stole the territory of the Palestinian people and killed them through missile strikes and other means.”  Some justify, rationalize their acts, and even sympathize with these criminals.
In these surveys, polls, and articles show some interesting thoughts from people in Muslim communities. Whether they’re in some EU countries where Islam is the minority religion, or in a country where Islam is the main religion and majority. These are in regards to Terrorism.

ICM Poll: 20% of British Muslims sympathize with 7/7 bombers


Channel Four (2006): 31% of younger British Muslims say 7/7 bombings were justified compared to 14% of those over 45.

People-Press: 31% of Turks support suicide attacks against Westerners in Iraq.

YNet: One third of Palestinians (32%) supported the slaughter of a Jewish family, including the children:

World Public Opinion (2009): 30% of Palestinians support attacks on American civilians working in Muslim countries.  24% support the murder of Americans on U.S. soil.
Only 74% of Turks and 55% of Pakistanis disapprove of terror attacks against civilians on U.S. soil.

Pew Research (2010): 55% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hezbollah
30% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hezbollah
45% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hezbollah (26% negative)
43% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hezbollah (30% negative)

There’s obviously a divide within the Muslim communities in regards to Terrorist attacks. Now in places where Muslims are a minority, like Great Britain, 20% of Muslims who happen to make 31% of young British Muslims justify and sympathize the 7/7 bombings. The remaining percentage are against the attacks completely or undecided.  In Turkey which makes up a majority of more than 90% of Muslims, whom are Sunnis, support suicide attacks on Westerners in Iraq. But a majority of Turks disapprove of terror attacks against civilians on U.S. soil. Now there is a divide in not only with Muslim radical extremist and moderate Muslims, but also with Shia and Sunni Muslims, which will be addressed later on.  Before I move on, there are more polls, surveys, and articles on not only Terrorism but in al-Qaeda, Osama bin Laden and Islamic State (ISIS).  The 9/11 Attacks, Violence in Defense of Islam, Sharia, Honor Killings, and Assimilation.


In the Muslim world there are Shia and Sunni Muslims. I’ve come to understand a key difference between the two groups. After the death of the Prophet Muhammad, there was a disagreement in who should lead Islam and the Muslims. The Shia Muslims believed that Ali bin Abu Talib, cousin of Prophet Muhammad, should lead. While the Sunni’s believed Abu Bakr, a close friend and advisor of Prophet Muhammad should lead. Though they do disagree on political views, they share the same Islamic beliefs and articles of faith. There are 87% to 90% of Sunni that make up the Muslim world while there are 10% to 13% of Shia Muslims. There are even some Sunni Muslims who think Shia Muslims, aren’t Muslim at all. That is up for debate within the Muslim community themselves.  Though many different Muslim nations claim absolute authority of Islam, which one’s are the majority and what do these majority groups support? Is it an Islam of peace or violence?  Iran has a majority of Shia Muslims in their country.  They do not practice Sharia Law but there have been modifications. In Saudi Arabia, the majority are Sunni and are under Sharia Law. In a country where you can be killed for being a homosexual or being an apostate leaving Islam. Non-Muslims are also not able to practice their religion. In terrorist organizations, ISIS, Hamas, and Al-Qaeda are all Sunni Muslim organizations. Hezbollah is a Lebanese Shia group. We know already a bit about these terrorist groups but the questions still remains, which Muslims are the Real Muslims? There are so many factors and countries that practice the same traditions. They keep to the Quran, fulfill, and follow every word. But at the same time, Moderate Muslims don’t agree with everything the Quran says because if they did, the term wouldn’t even exist. These extremist groups truly believe they are doing the will of Allah in the Quran. Sunni or Shia in both countries and terrorist groups, follow the Quran. I’ve come to understand that there is no such thing as a Moderate Muslim. Either you follow the Quran, the ideologies, or traditions or you don’t. It’s as simple as that.

. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judicial_system_of_Iran

But now we see another problem within the Muslim community. Those who claim Islam is a religion of peace, which are referred to Moderate Muslims. Which seem to be a minority all on it’s own.

There is an uncanny irony here that many have noticed. The position of the Muslim community in the face of all provocations seems to be: Islam is a religion of peace, and if you say that it isn’t, we will kill you. Of course, the truth is often more nuanced, but this is about as nuanced as it ever gets: Islam is a religion of peace, and if you say that it isn’t, we peaceful Muslims cannot be held responsible for what our less peaceful brothers and sisters do. When they burn your embassies or kidnap and slaughter your journalists, know that we will hold you primarily responsible and will spend the bulk of our energies criticizing you for “racism” and “Islamophobia.”


Quote:“Did the Muslim Brotherhood Invent the Term Islamophobia?,” by Cheradenine Zakalwe at Islam Versus Europe, August 26:
    That the Muslim Brotherhood invented the term Islamophobia has become a
    commonplace on the Counterjihad scene. But is it true? The only evidence
    for it seems to be the undocumented assertions of Abdur-Rahman
    Muhammad, a former Muslim radical turned “moderate”.
    He has made the following statements about the creation of the term islamophobia:
        That’s the reason why the question of whether America is
        “Islamophobic” – now bandied about so casually, as though opposition to
        the mosque has revealed a nasty strain in the American psyche, akin to
        the terrible racism or anti-Semitism that once ran wild – is so deeply
        offensive. This loathsome term is nothing more than a
        thought-terminating cliche conceived in the bowels of Muslim think tanks
        for the purpose of beating down critics.
    In an effort to silence critics of political Islam,
    advocates needed to come up with terminology that would enable them to
    portray themselves as victims. Muhammad said he was present when his
    then- allies, meeting at the offices of the International Institute for
    Islamic Thought (IIIT) in Northern Virginia years ago, coined the term
    Muhammad said the Islamists decided to emulate the homosexual activists
    who used the term “homophobia” to silence critics. He said the group
    meeting at IIIT saw “Islamophobia” as a way to “beat up their critics.”


Here is an all too common example of a Muslim college student who appears to be moderate.  As a member of the Muslim Student's Association she asks David Horowitz a question during a Young Americans for Freedom forum meeting at the University of California San Diego. In the process of answering her question, Mr. Horowitz asks her a question.  Here answer answers her question for all who are listening.

So here’s the bottom line, in regards to these groups, because now that I think of it, I don’t believe I ever asked this question like David Horowitz did. Do any Muslims on this forum condemn any of the terrorist groups or acts that kill in the name of Allah and the Quran? Do you condemn Hamas, ISIS, Al-Qaeda, and Hezbollah? If not, then why?
If there are Muslims, like this college student in the video above, then we seriously have some problems that need to be addressed.There are many passages In the Quran that do state, violence against non-believers. I’m not going to get into the Prophet Muhammad being married to his under aged wife because I’m trying to focus on who the real Muslims are.  I will post a summary and of the link provided and I hopefully, I can get some answers from all the questions I have brought up over the entirety of this thread.

Quote:The Quran contains at least 109 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers for the sake of Islamic rule. Some are quite graphic, with commands to chop off heads and fingers and kill infidels wherever they may be hiding. Muslims who do not join the fight are called 'hypocrites' and warned that Allah will send them to Hell if they do not join the slaughter.


My final conclusion throughout all the sources I have posted including some common knowledge with the beliefs of many leaders in the Islamic world. I believe that the Real Muslims are the one's who truly follow the many commands of Prophet Muhammad the Quran thoroughly.  Also, I don't believe Islam is a religion of peace. Looking forward to this discussion, thank you.

Matthew 6:34
"Therefore do not be anxious about tomorrow, for tomorrow will be anxious for itself. Sufficient for the day is it's own trouble."
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04-25-2016, 04:48 AM #2
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tldr, did however notice the sources. wiki (playfully known as ziopedia) , jihadwatch, reigionofpeace, ect.

Are you looking for answers, or to promote Aiylishs views?

Lets start with religion of peace (no, not the website). There are what, a dozen Muslims here? You been here idk, 6 months, 5 years?

Can you site a single post with a Muslim ever calling to violence? Just one?

"My heart is at ease knowing that what was meant for me will never
miss me and that what misses me was never meant for me"

~Umar Ibn Al-Khattab (ra)

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04-25-2016, 04:49 AM #3
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@ OP

if you want apples, don't go to the baker, mate.

This post was last modified: 04-25-2016, 04:54 AM by Scimitar.

Out beyond ideas
of wrong-doing,

and right-doing,

there is a field...

...I'll meet you there.

Jalaluddin Rumi
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04-25-2016, 04:53 AM #4
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The true Muslims are those who uphold that God, Allah, is One, who has no partners, sons, daughters... He is separate and above His Creation.

Those who believe in Muhammad PBUH and the Prophets that came before him, follow his sunna (example) and whatever the Quran dictates.

Those who believe that the Quran is the Literal word of God, unchanged to the letter since its revelation.

Only Allah is the Judge when it comes to determining who is a Good Muslim or not, as only He is acquainted with the hearts.

"Some good qualities that Muslims should acquire:

Below we give, in the words of the Holy Quran and the Holy Prophet Muhammad, the chief qualities a Muslim should display:

1. Truthfulness:

"O you who believe! keep your duty to Allah and speak straight, true words." (Holy Quran 33:70)
"O you who believe, keep your duty to Allah, and be with the truthful people." (9:119)
"Be maintainers of justice and bearers of true witness for Allah, even if it (the truth) goes against your own selves or parents or relatives or someone who is rich or poor." (4:135)

2. Sincerity:

"Serve Allah, being sincere to Him in obedience." (39:2)
"It is most hateful in the sight of Allah that you say things which you do not do." (61:3)
"Woe to those who pray but are unmindful of their prayers, who do good to be seen." (107:4-6)

3. Unselfishness:

"You cannot attain to righteousness unless you spend (in charity) out of those things which you love." (3:91)
"They (the true believers) give food, out of love for Allah, to the poor, the orphan and the slave, saying: We feed you only for Allah's pleasure - we desire from you neither reward nor thanks." (76:8-9)
"Do no favour seeking gain." (74:6)

4. Humility:

"The servants of the Beneficent (Allah) are those who walk on the earth in humility." (25:63)
"Do not turn your face away from people in contempt, nor go about in the land exultingly." (31:18)
"Do not ascribe purity to yourselves. Allah knows best who is righteous." (53:32)

5. Patience:

"Allah loves those who are patient." (3:145)
"Give good news to the patient, who, when a misfortune befalls them, say: We are Allah's and to Him do we return." (2:155-156)

6. Forgiveness:

"Pardon (people) and overlook (their faults). Don't you love that Allah should forgive you." (24:22)
"(The dutiful are) . . . those who restrain their anger and pardon people. Allah loves those who do good to others." (3:134)
"Whenever they (true believers) are angry they forgive." (42:37)
"The recompense of evil is punishment like it. But whoever forgives (an evil committed against himself) and amends (matters), his reward is with Allah. . . . Whoever is patient and forgives, that is a matter of great resolution." (42:40, 43)
When the Holy Prophet Muhammad defeated his enemies in Makka and returned to that city as its conqueror, he forgave them in the following words:
"No reproof be against you this day; Allah may forgive you, and He is the most Merciful of those who show mercy." (12:92)

7. Purity and cleanliness:

"He indeed is successful who purifies himself (in mind and body), and remembers the name of his Lord, then prays." (87:14-15)
"Purify your garments and shun uncleanness." (74:4-5)

8. Honesty:

"Don't go near the property of an orphan, except in a goodly way, till he attains maturity. And fulfil the promise (you make) . . .. Give full measure when you measure out, and weigh with a true balance." (17:34-35)
"Do not swallow up your property among yourselves by false means, nor offer it as a bribe to the officials so that you may swallow up other people's property unlawfully while you know." (2:188)

9. Goodness and kindness to others:

"Allah commands you to uphold justice and to do good to others and to give to the relatives." (16:90)
Three degrees of doing good are mentioned here: "justice," which means returning any good that someone has done you with equal good; "do good to others," which means taking the initiative in doing good to others; and "give to the relatives," which means doing good to people instinctively and naturally just as one does good to one's close relatives.
"Do good to others, surely Allah loves those who do good to others." (2:195)

10. Consideration and respect for others:

"O you who believe! do not enter houses other than your own until you have asked permission and greeted the inmates . . . and if it is said to you, 'Go back', then go back." (24:27-28)
"O you who believe! avoid most of suspicion (against others), for surely suspicion in some cases is sin; and do not spy (into other people's affairs), nor let some of you backbite others." (49:12)
"When you are greeted with a greeting, greet with one better than it, or return it (in the same terms at least)." (4:86)

11. Courage:

Speaking of a small number of Muslims facing a big and powerful enemy, the Quran relates:
"Those to whom men said: people have gathered against you, so fear them; but this increased their faith, and they said: Allah is sufficient for us and He is an excellent Guardian." (3:173)

12. Moderation:

"Eat and drink, but do not be immoderate." (7:31)
"Do not chain your hand to your neck (so that you are mean in spending), nor stretch it out to the utmost limit (so that you waste everything)." (17:29)
Regarding the performance of religious duties, the Holy Prophet has given the following advice:
"Religion is easy, but any one who exerts himself too much in religious devotions will get overcome by it; so you should just act rightly, and keep to the mean, and be of good cheer, and ask for Allah's help morning, evening, and a part of the night." (Bukhari.)

13. Cheerfulness:

"Be of good cheer." (Holy Prophet in Bukhari.)
"It is an act of charity to meet your fellow with a cheerful face." (Holy Prophet in Mishkat.)
Finally, we give a verse of the Holy Quran mentioning a number of qualities a Muslim, man or woman, should try to acquire:

"The truthful men and the truthful women, the patient men and the patient women, the humble men and the humble women, the charitable men and the charitable women, the fasting men and the fasting women, the men who guard their chastity and the women who guard their chastity, the men who remember Allah much and the women who remember Allah much - for all these Allah has prepared forgiveness and a great reward." (33:35)
116. How does Islam require a Muslim to treat the people around him?

The Holy Quran and the Hadith mention various categories of people that one has to deal with, and give a great deal of guidance on how to behave towards them.

1. Parents and the elderly:

"Your Lord has commanded that you worship none but Him, and do good to parents. If one or both of them reach old age with you, do not say 'Fie' to them, nor chide them, but speak to them a generous word . . . and say, My Lord, have mercy on them as they brought me up when I was little." (17:23-24).
"The Holy Prophet said, It is one of the greatest sins that a man should curse his parents. Someone said, How can a man curse his own parents? He said, If a man abuses the father of another, that person will abuse his parents (in return)." (Report in Bukhari.)

2. Other Near Relatives:

"Do good to the near relatives." (4:36)
"Give to the near relative his due, and also to the needy and to the traveller (in need of help). (17:26).

3. Children:

"Do not kill your children for fear of poverty - We (Allah) provide for them and for you." (17:31)
"A man came to the Holy Prophet and said, `You kiss children but we do not kiss them'. The Holy Prophet said, `Do I have any control over you if Allah has taken away mercy from your heart'." (Report in Bukhari.)

4. Orphans and destitute children:

"Maintain the orphans out of their property and clothe them and give them a good education. Test them when they reach the age of majority, and if you find them to be mature, hand over their property to them." (4:5-6)
"I and the man who brings up an orphan will be in paradise like this," said the Holy Prophet, putting together his forefinger and middle finger. (Report in Bukhari.)

5. Poor and needy:

"Righteous is he who . . . gives away wealth out of love for Him to the near of kin and the orphans and the needy and the wayfarer and to those who ask and to set slaves free." (2:177)
"What will make you understand what the uphill road (to success) is? (It is) to free a slave, or feed at a time of hunger an orphan who is a relative or the poor man lying in the dust." (90:11-16)
"Have you seen him who goes against religion? That is the one who is rough to the orphan and does not urge the feeding of the needy." (107:1-3)
"(The true believers are those) in whose wealth there is a known right for the beggar and the destitute." (70:24-25)
"The person who manages things for the widow and the poor is like the one who strives hard in the way of Allah." (Holy Prophet in Bukhari.)

6. Neighbours:

"Be good to . . . the neighbour belonging to your people and the alien neighbour." (4:36)
"He is not a believer who fills his stomach while his neighbour is hungry." (Holy Prophet in Hadith.)
"The angel Gabriel continued to enjoin upon me good treatment of the neighbour, so much so that I thought he would make him heir to one's property." (Holy Prophet in Bukhari.)

7. Wives/Husbands:

"They (your wives) are a garment for you, and you are a garment for them." (2:187)
"Of His (Allah's) signs is that He created spouses for you from yourselves so that you might find quiet of mind in them, and He put between you love and compassion." (30:21)
"The best of you are those who are kindest to their wives." (Holy Prophet in Tirmizi.)
A man related:
"I asked Aishah (Holy Prophet's wife): What did the Prophet do when in his house? She said, `He served his wife', meaning that he did work for his wife." (Report in Bukhari.)

8. Employers/Employees:

"(The true believers) are those who are keepers of their trusts and covenants." (23:8)
"Trusts" include the duties and the other things with which an employee is entrusted by his employer; "covenants" include the contract by which both the employer and the employee are bound.
"Allah says: There are three persons whose opponents I shall be on the Day of Judgment . . . (the third is) the person who employs a servant and receives fully the labour due from him, but does not pay his wages." (Holy Prophet in Bukhari.)
Ans, a companion of the Holy Prophet, related:
"I served the Holy Prophet for ten years, and he never said to me, `Fie', nor did he ever say `Why have you done this', or `Why have you not done that'." (Report in Bukhari.)

9. Animals

"There is no animal in the earth, nor a bird flying on its two wings, but they are communities like yourselves (O people)." (6:38)
Someone asked the Holy Prophet, "Is there a reward for us (from Allah) for doing good to beasts?" He replied:
"In every animal having a liver fresh with life there is a reward." (Holy Prophet in Mishkat.)
"Be careful of your duty to Allah in the matter of dumb animals; ride them while they are in a fit condition, and eat them while they are in a fit condition." (Holy Prophet in Abu Dawud.)
"Whoever tills a field, and birds and beasts eat from it, it is an act of charity." (Holy Prophet in Musnad of Ahmad.)

10. Authorities:

Regarding electing and appointing people to positions of authority, the Quran says:
"Allah commands you to make over trusts (or positions of trust and authority) to those worthy of them." (4:58)
Some other principles are as follows:
"Obey Allah and obey the Messenger and those in authority from among you; then if you quarrel about anything (with your authorities) refer it to Allah and the Messenger" (4:59), i.e. settle the disagreement by means of the Holy Quran and the Holy Prophet's example.
"Obedience (of authority) is due only in good matters", i.e., orders to do wrong must not be obeyed. (Holy Prophet in Bukhari.)
The first head of state of the Muslims after the Holy Prophet, the famous Hazrat Abu Bakr, said in a speech after his election:
"Help me if I am in the right. Correct me if I am in the wrong. Obey me as long as I obey Allah and His Messenger; in case I disobey Allah and His Messenger, I have no right to obedience from you."
"The most excellent jihad is to speak the truth in the face of an unjust ruler." (Holy Prophet in Mishkat.)

11. Muslims:

"Hold fast by the covenant of Allah all together and be not disunited. And remember Allah's favour to you when you were enemies, then He united your hearts, so by His favour you became brethren." (3:103)
"The believers are brethren, so make peace between your brethren . . . Do not find fault with your own people, nor call one another by (bad) nick­names." (49:10-12)
"Help one another in good and righteous works, and do not help one another in sin and aggression." (5:2)
"Do not hate one another and do not be jealous of one another and do not boycott one another, and be servants of Allah, as brothers; and it is not lawful for a Muslim to sever his relations with his brother for more than three days." (Holy Prophet in Bukhari.)
"You will see the believers in their having mercy for one another, and in their love for one another, and in their kindness towards one another, like the human body: when one limb is ailing, the whole body feels it, one part calling out the other with sleeplessness and fever." (Holy Prophet in Bukhari.)
"None of you has faith until he loves for his brother what he loves for himself." (Holy Prophet in Bukhari.)

12. Those who abuse Muslims:

"Bear patiently what they (abusers) say." (20:130)
"Disregard their annoying talk." (33:48)
"When you hear Allah's messages disbelieved in and mocked at, sit not with them until they enter into some other talk." (4:140)
"And if you invite them to guidance, they hear not; and you see them looking towards you, yet they see not. Take to forgiveness and enjoin good and turn away from the ignorant." (7:198-199)
"The Messenger of Allah and his Companions used to forgive the idolaters and the followers of the book (Jews and Christians), as Allah had commanded them, and they used to show patience on hearing hurtful words." (Report in Bukhari.)

13. Enemies:

"Repel evil with what is best, when lo! he between whom and you there is enmity will be like a warm friend." (41:34)
"Many of the people of the book wish that they could turn you back into disbelievers after you have believed, out of envy from themselves. . .. But pardon and forgive." (2:109)
"And you will always find treachery in them, except a few of them. So pardon them and forgive. Surely Allah loves those who do good to others." (5:13)

14. Non ­Muslims:

"Allah does not forbid you concerning those people who do not fight you because of your religion, nor expel you from your homes, that you show them kindness and deal with them justly.. . . Allah forbids you only concerning those people who fight you for your religion, and drive you from your homes and help others to expel you, that you make friends of them." (60: 8,9)
"Whatever good they (people of other religions) do, they will not be denied it (by Allah), and Allah knows who the righteous are." (3:115)
"O you who believe, be upright for Allah, bearers of witness with justice; and do not let the hatred of a people incite you not to act with justice. Be just; that is nearer to observance of duty." (5:8)
"Call (others) to the way of your Lord with wisdom and goodly exhortation, and argue with them in the best manner." (16:125)
"Argue not with the people of the Book (Jews, Christians, and other people having scriptures) except by the best (means), save those of them who act unjustly. But say: We believe in that which has been revealed to us and revealed to you, and our God and your God is One, and to Him we submit." (29:46)
A companion of the Holy Prophet relates:
"A funeral procession passed by the Holy Prophet, and he stood up for it. People said to him: It was the funeral of a Jew. He said: Was it not a human life?" (Report in Bukhari.)

15. Mankind generally:

"Mankind is a single nation." (2:213)
"O mankind! We have created you from a male and a female, and made you into races and families so that you may know each other. The most honoured of you in Allah's sight are those who best keep their duty." (49:13)
"We (Allah) have not sent you (O Muhammad) except as a mercy to the nations." (21:107)
"Speak good words to all people." (2:83)
"Allah commands you that . . . when you judge between people (i.e., of any race, religion, family, class, etc.), you judge with justice." (4:58)"


Now what makes a real Christian?

A crusading one? Big Grin
This post was last modified: 04-25-2016, 04:56 AM by Tarikko.

“The lies (Western slander) which well-meaning zeal has heaped round this man (Muhammad) are disgraceful to ourselves only.”

― Thomas Carlyle, On Heroes, Hero Worship and the Heroic in History

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04-25-2016, 04:56 AM #5
Grand Commander
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(04-25-2016, 04:48 AM)Alex Wrote:  Can you site a single post with a Muslim ever calling to violence?  Just one?

that's a blindingly good point Smile

That1Kid Big Grin can you? lol NOPE.


Out beyond ideas
of wrong-doing,

and right-doing,

there is a field...

...I'll meet you there.

Jalaluddin Rumi
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  • Tarikko

04-25-2016, 05:07 AM #6
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(04-25-2016, 04:56 AM)Scimitar Wrote:  
(04-25-2016, 04:48 AM)Alex Wrote:  Can you site a single post with a Muslim ever calling to violence?  Just one?

that's a blindingly good point Smile

That1Kid Big Grin can you? lol NOPE.


I just don't understand these fox news types. The reality is vastly different then what they are fed 24/7 on their tv, yet the tv's narrative is the only one they know. God forbid any of them might step foot in a mosque and attempt to get a clue.

How easily they forget the Kareem Abdul Jabbars, Muhammad Ali's, Malcolm X's.

"My heart is at ease knowing that what was meant for me will never
miss me and that what misses me was never meant for me"

~Umar Ibn Al-Khattab (ra)

The following 2 users Like Alex's post:
  • Tarikko, Scimitar

04-25-2016, 05:15 AM #7
Grand Commander
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He should ask himself, if he has truly with hand on heart and God as his witness - ever seen a Muslim shout profanity against Jesus pbuh EVER... and then ask himself to apply the same to Christians and their view of Muhammad pbuh.

His thread will dissolve into water like salt and disappear.

This reality we are in - we can all witness.


Out beyond ideas
of wrong-doing,

and right-doing,

there is a field...

...I'll meet you there.

Jalaluddin Rumi
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  • Alex, Tarikko

04-25-2016, 05:49 AM #8
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I was hoping for an actual discussion here from the Muslim community. None of you except for Tarikko have given at least a minor defense in what attributes a Muslim should have. Though it was copy and paste, I still appreciate something rather than nothing. It's unfortunate that none of you have answered my question in who the Real Muslims are. Please do not divert the direct questions being asked here. Alex if you have not read this thread, avoid the questions all together, and post without any substance ,along with Schimitar, don't expect me to take any of you seriously. The problem with you two I see most often, is when you're being challenged, even in the most respectful way, you don't give a direct response to the topic at hand. That's what these forums are for, to discuss and help answer questions. That's why I asked the Muslim community because who else would I ask? Do you remember when I said, I don't base my facts off a single source?  Only if there's consistency from numerous sources based on the motion being true. Now please, if you haven't already, read my thread and answer some of my questions. I will respond as soon as I can. Thank you.

Matthew 6:34
"Therefore do not be anxious about tomorrow, for tomorrow will be anxious for itself. Sufficient for the day is it's own trouble."
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  • Thunderian

04-25-2016, 05:56 AM #9
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Well Kid,

As you said, someone already answered you.,.. and you can trust that All Muslims here will endorse my reply, as I'm not sure you noticed yet, but Muslims here are one unit Mashallah.

So yeah, you can rebutt my answer and we take it from there.

Let me add one more thing.

Listing atrocities conducted in the name of Islam will not bode well for you... if you have one page, I can get a 100 times the amount for atrocities committed in the name of the Church Rolleyes
This post was last modified: 04-25-2016, 06:01 AM by Tarikko.

“The lies (Western slander) which well-meaning zeal has heaped round this man (Muhammad) are disgraceful to ourselves only.”

― Thomas Carlyle, On Heroes, Hero Worship and the Heroic in History

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04-25-2016, 05:57 AM #10
Grand Commander
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@ That1kid,

go to your local mosque lol - you'll find plenty of "real muslims" there, go speak to a few.

You'll be pleasantry surprised as to how welcoming we are.

You want me to define the fake Muslims? Sure - you know that Jew? Simon Elliot who is currently posing as the leader of ISIS - Khaliph al Baghdadi? that's a fake Muslim.

What do you want? Big Grin a few brain cells that can help you to add 1 + 1 together? oh wait - that's not gonna work lol.

This post was last modified: 04-25-2016, 05:59 AM by Scimitar.

Out beyond ideas
of wrong-doing,

and right-doing,

there is a field...

...I'll meet you there.

Jalaluddin Rumi
The following 2 users Like Scimitar's post:
  • Alex, Tarikko